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Messages - TK17

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21
North Carolina / Re: Pssst! TK's got a video up there in Pics and Vids ...
« on: November 28, 2007, 05:44:50 AM »
A more detailed set of instructions to help you out  ???

When you click on the Megaupload link, you'll see a picture of three characters near the top, just to the right of the Megaupload logo.  It says "Please enter AES (or HKK or WVR or whatever) here" and then there's a text box and a button that says "Download."

Enter the three characters.  Click download.  It'll take you to a new screen with two checklist columns.  One of them costs money.  The other says "Wait 45 seconds" and it's counting down.  Eventually, the button changes to "free download."

Not that hard, really.   :P

22
Pics & Vids / Re: Go - A parkour sampler by TK17
« on: November 27, 2007, 07:58:03 PM »
Well, I usually roll when in doubt, so many more of my landings are rolls than the average traceur.  I'm well aware that it's my strong suit and a good way to work, as a heavy person.

I'm going to give it a go re-filming that 2:23 landing, undistorted so you can have a better understanding of the setup and the true shape of the obstacle, some time in the near future, and I'll put the vid up by itself for you and others to offer thoughts and advice, both on the particular technique I'm already using, and also on possible alternate methods of dealing with it.  That might be a week or a month down the road, but I'll PM you when it's up so you can participate in the discussion (probably will be on PKNA).

As for the 90-degree rule, I LOOSELY comply with it.  I never force it in a situation where it feels unnatural (which is often).

Muse_of_Fire is almost prescient in what he picked up about my movement, and now that I think of it, the "uncomfortableness" that Animus was seeing might be related to this ... until the last year or so, my training had not been geared towards what I now think is true parkour.  I started through martial arts, then random flips and tricks, then freerunning, then idiot's parkour, then parkour.  So, up until recently, most of my motion was single-tech, and flow was something I didn't work on much.  So, what you two are both picking up on might be the flicker of hesitancy at the beginning and the end of each move, where my body is thinking "start" and "stop" instead of just continually flowing.  That is DEFINITELY something I'm working on more these days, but again ... the clips for this vid are up to 2.5 years old, so you're actually seeing leaps ahead and backwards within a single video.

23
Pics & Vids / Re: Go - A parkour sampler by TK17
« on: November 27, 2007, 06:34:31 PM »
Hmm.  Okay, first off, the "criticism" was taken as constructive, thoroughly so, so I'm not arguing or feeling defensive or upset.  I'm just going to "think out loud" as I respond.

I have to disagree - conditionally - on the landings criticism.  However, I'm completely open to a more in-depth explanation of what you find wrong with them, so if you can provide me with some clear explanations and tips I'm more than ready to hear them and take them into account.  I doubt you would have made the comment unless you had something concrete and specific in mind, so please, by all means, share!  I am well aware of one or two rough landings in the video, but no more than that.

1.  I definitely DO NOT prepare for drops by bringing mats.  Forgive me if I wasn't clear on that post ... I prepared for a SINGLE jump, one that was not a drop but a level gap, by bringing mats, and the mats were not actually placed on the landing point at all, but before it, in case I fell short due to a lack of commitment.

2.  In the entire history of my parkour training, I have taken drops of greater than thirteen feet zero times, greater than ten feet only four times, greater than eight feet fewer than 20 times, and greater than six feet less than one session every two or three months.  I practice small drops of less than three feet, both "dropping" and leaping forward, both slapping and rolling, every week, in large quantities, being careful to "think inside my joints," constantly reviewing my own technique and adjusting to the environment.  I also practice more "medium" drops of 4-6 feet several times a month, again being careful to pay close attention to my technique, and to how my body feels before, during, and after a session.  I work both on grass/mulch and concrete, with shoes on and off.  I feel very accustomed to, and comfortable within, my own body.  I have been working on the shock-absorbing roll for nearly nine years and have never had a criticism leveled at it, and I have been studying and practicing drop technique seriously for nearly three years now.  I've also trained, variously, for "silence," "slow absorption," "90-degree rule," and "collapsing," depending on the theory-of-the-moment that caught my eye and seemed to make sense - in other words, I haven't blindly stuck with one technique, but have been doing research and adjusting myself.

Again, this is not meant to be defensive, but informative: I think you might have added together things that you've seen with false assumptions about me and my training.  That doesn't AT ALL invalidate whatever it is you saw, so I'm definitely eager for clarification on that.  Personally, if I were to list the landings that I REMEMBER feeling bad, they would be the gap jump with the two freeze frames, and the recovery from the wallclimb-through-the-tight-space.  If I were to widen the "bad" definition to things that were wobbly or otherwise iffy, I would also include the drop into the "stone box" near the beginning of the video.  And that would be it.

As noted above to Frosti:
Quote
The underbar at 3:20 is the only extraneous movement that really, truly, isn't justified at all.  I tried to slip it in under the radar, but you're right, it does very little.   However, the tac at 3:13 was envisioned as a fakeout in a situation where I am being chased ... your average pursuer would not be fast enough to come around the wall and would likely be thrown off by that particular skill, because he would have to either run up the ramp, turn all the way around, or come awkwardly over the intervening wall.  I agree that there's a kind of hypocrisy in terms of things like Blane's videos ... people are so blown away by his power, skill, control, and attitude that they don't "criticize" the inefficiencies.  However, I did my best to remove them from my own video, while at the same time EMPHASIZING the fact that some inefficient-seeming moves are actually true parkour.  The underbar at 3:20 was the sole example of something that's great for training, but not truly parkour in and of itself.

My main point with the disclaimer was not actually to "justify" certain iffy moves, but to encourage a double-take in the ongoing efficiency debate.  I, personally, believe that efficiency depends on three things: safety, simplicity, and speed.  But since each of these three things is independent of the others, multiple techniques can be "equally" efficient, does that make sense?  You can sacrifice a little safety for speed, or you can be a little more complex and maybe a little slower if it makes things safer overall.  Certainly, you could argue that I chose poor examples for my argument, but some of the major points I wanted to highlight include:

Rail slide down the stairs (2:19): faster and POTENTIALLY more controlled than running and skipping two or three steps at a time, safer than turning and dropping, and leads smoothly into a shock-absorbing roll.

360 dismount from a landing (2:22): It's difficult to see because of the fisheye, but the combination of vertical drop and horizontal momentum on that landing, combined with the slant of the wall, means that you have a choice between "rolling" with the landing, as I did, or quite literally tripling the strain on your knees, ankles, and wrists to try to rebound directly without turning, because actually you wouldn't be "rebounding" at all ... you'd be absorbing, killing all of your momentum, and then shoving off again sideways before falling towards the ground with unpredictable momentum.

180 cat/cat to cat (2:30): Again, it's difficult to see from that angle, but the way the wall is structured, if you were to come straight in through the door and try to passe muraille directly, you wouldn't be able to do it because of the structure of the stones, and angling into the corner puts your wrists near some rusted metal sticking out of the wall. So it wasn't efficient in and of itself, but more of a reaction to the imperfect environment. Had those walls been smoother, I would've gone straight over.

Reverse vault over rail (3:03): Sheer trial and error.  To be honest, I RESISTED the reverse technique here for almost an hour before I gave in.  Due to the speed and direction of the shoulder roll, the natural exit point has foot placement and torso momentum such that it requires extra energy and time to straighten out and go for any other kind of vault.  Lazy vaults result in clipping, monkeys require stutter step, etc. etc.  I actually took a stopwatch, there's nothing else I could think of.  However, just to prove the point, by NOT rolling, other options become open, which is why I "doubled" the clip.

Monkey to underbar (3:10):  Aesthetics and "clean" technique would dictate that I take the underbar smoothly, with no foot tap.  But trial and error showed that it didn't slow me down at all, and at the same time gave me much more control.

Tac to lazy (3:13): See above.

Underbar (3:20): See above (mea culpa).

Speed-Reverse (3:31): This was a longtime "project" of mine, to explore other alternatives to the diving kong or double kong, and this was one of the smoothest and fastest I came up with, especially in situations where the "roof" is cramped enough to prevent simple jump-up-and-run-over.

Turn to underbar (4:00): Similar to the tac lazy, envisioned as a fakeout/retaliatory direction change.  When training, I review parkour in several ways, according to the different descriptions I've heard over the years: sometimes I think A to B and B to A, sometimes I think in terms of reach and escape, sometimes I think about chasing, and sometimes I think about being chased.  They're all different mindsets, and they lend themselves to different categories of techniques.

Runby (5:20):  This was one of my favorites, no one's commented on it yet.  I deliberately placed a "perfect" obstacle in the center of the screen, and did ABSOLUTELY NOTHING with it, because quite frankly, nobody EVER would, except to drill a technique: it's in the middle of a giant field of concrete and requires no special movement.

All of these things are deliberate ... as stated in the intro, it's an artistic piece ... not strictly for entertainment.  There is meaning behind it, and this kind of debate is actually what I was HOPING to spark with it.  So don't take my explanations as the "end" of the argument, Animus ... I've laid these opinions on the line specifically so that people WILL challenge them, and we can talk them out.  These were my thoughts, and at this point, I want to know how you'll respond.

:)  Thanks for taking the time to actually think it through.  That's a big compliment in and of itself.
-TK17

24
Pics & Vids / Re: Go - A parkour sampler by TK17
« on: November 27, 2007, 08:21:25 AM »
Thanks everyone for the comments so far!

Lauriejennifer: I really appreciate your comments on the "spirit" of the video ... that was exactly the sort of thing I was going for, and the things you said I DIDN'T do, were things I was specifically avoiding, so I feel very validated.  :):)

JBF28:  If you have a minute to tell me which vaults could use work specifically, like where they were in the video, I'd appreciate it, but otherwise I'll just continue improving every aspect as much as I can.  Glad you liked it.

Cblock: Cheers.  ;)

Demon:  Thanks so much for taking the time to give a detailed response.  The climbups at 2:32 and 2:35 were, ironically, some of the last filmed for the video, but they were done on a day when I'd had little sleep, little exercise in the previous week, and a lot of training already that morning.  As for them being unbalanced, I only just recently broke the both-hands-at-once barrier, but I've also made a point of alternating when I drill, so if I do left hand first once, I'll do right hand first the next time, to stay even.  It's also really interesting that you pointed out the air position in just those two jumps, specifically, because those were the two where I was the most frightened/tense/unsure of my ability.  It's a good commentary on how pushing your limits a little too quickly can lead to bad technique, which in turn can lead to unpleasant results.  The takeoff at 3:29, you make a very good point, and I actually felt the things you were talking about.  Two clarifications, though ... first, I had to not roll into the street :P and second, the drop isn't actually as far as it looks, thanks to the fisheye lens.  It's big, certainly ... 8 feet is nothing to sneer at.  But not as huge as it might seem.  As for 3:40, 4:43, and 4:49, I agree with all three, and had already thought of them, and I'm glad to hear you supporting that little voice in the back of my mind ;).

Your comments on the spirit and nature of the video were deeply appreciated, as those were exactly the things I was going for.  The locations are mainly UNC Chapel Hill, which is honestly more obstacular than Lisses/Evry, and the courthouse plaza in Greensboro, NC.  Both are within an hour's drive of my house, in opposite directions, and the places that I rushed to every morning I woke up to find a dry, cloudy day (we don't get many here in NC).  The multiple shots were actually something of a lucky coincidence.  At first, I was hoping my friends would help me film, would be around to hold the camera, but as I was waiting for cloudy days, they were constantly busy or had other commitments they couldn't get out of, so I started using the tripod.  Realizing that was boring, having the camera completely still in every shot, I decided to do something to mix it up a little, and as a result it opened up my mind and my training in a very beneficial way.  I also sort of enjoy the philosophical implications of a static world where I'm the only thing moving.

You mentioned virtuosity in some movements but not others.  I'm curious as to which were which (besides the muscleups :P) because I kind of thought most things were at the same level:  high-intermediate.  So if there were some that stood out as extraordinarily clean, I'd be interested to know which and why.  Last, the POV camera ... ha ha ha, funny story.  I actually bought a helmet camera before going to Lisses this summer, a nice tiny little lipstick-tube sized thing with a fisheye lens and TV-quality resolution.  It broke.  Don't know how.  So to get that shot, I actually had to take duct tape and bungee cords and strap an ordinary camcorder to my head.  It was really difficult because I couldn't exactly breathe very well, I had to attach it so tightly around my jaw ... was an interesting kind of training, made me think about swimming long distances underwater or training in Colorado ... places with not much air.  ;)

Frosti:  You caught me on one, I have an explanation on the other.  The underbar at 3:20 is the only extraneous movement that really, truly, isn't justified at all.  I tried to slip it in under the radar, but you're right, it does very little. :-[  However, the tac at 3:13 was envisioned as a fakeout in a situation where I am being chased ... your average pursuer would not be fast enough to come around the wall and would likely be thrown off by that particular skill, because he would have to either run up the ramp, turn all the way around, or come awkwardly over the intervening wall.  I agree that there's a kind of hypocrisy in terms of things like Blane's videos ... people are so blown away by his power, skill, control, and attitude that they don't "criticize" the inefficiencies.  However, I did my best to remove them from my own video, while at the same time EMPHASIZING the fact that some inefficient-seeming moves are actually true parkour.  The underbar at 3:20 was the sole example of something that's great for training, but not truly parkour in and of itself.

BNP, Acewall, Crazymex:  Thanks so much for your kind comments, I'm really glad you found the vid worth watching.

PaddyOHayes:  That's quite a compliment you gave me there, mate.  I also appreciate the fact that you're not afraid to say that flow could be better, because of course you're right!  A lot of people don't say that when they think a vid is good because they think it'll offend the vidmaker.  But I couldn't agree with you more ... always moving forward.

Moa: That kind of "I will try to do a similar thing" is the greatest compliment I can think of ... I train to become the kind of traceur I see in my heroes, and I make videos to try to accomplish the same things as the videos I love, and that's how I learn best.  So that tells me that I'm truly on the right track, here.  Thanks for watching.

Keep the comments coming, if you don't mind.   :-X

;)

Thanks, everyone,
-TK17

25
North Carolina / Re: Pssst! TK's got a video up there in Pics and Vids ...
« on: November 27, 2007, 07:18:35 AM »
No, you don't need the download manager ... just click the link, wait 45 seconds, and then click download.  Or, like Muhammad said, you could just watch the Youtube.

800 views in the first 12 hours  :o :o :o

26
North Carolina / Pssst! TK's got a video up there in Pics and Vids ...
« on: November 26, 2007, 08:36:30 PM »
... and he'd really like some feedback from the people who actually know him and have trained with him, and that's you.  ;)

27
Pics & Vids / Go - A parkour sampler by TK17
« on: November 26, 2007, 11:58:25 AM »
Having spent the last two and a half years on this project, I could probably fill up a dozen pages talking about it, and how I made it, and why I made certain choices, and what the video means to me.  If people are interested in hearing that stuff, I'll come back and say it.  But as it is, I think the video speaks for itself.

Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3kaHBUs-2A
Download: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=VR6J706I

The following is an "unedited" copy of the video, composed of unaltered raw footage including natural sound, for anyone who is willing to take the time to offer serious criticism or advice on my technique.  I consider myself thoroughly average in the world of parkour, a very intermediate traceur, and as such, I'm well aware that I have room for improvement in a lot of ways, and I'm eager for your help:

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=LPELHBEX

Any and all comments are welcome, and the more in-depth they are the more they'll be appreciated ... I'd rather read a thousand words telling me how terrible it is than see a one-liner that just says "Hey, good job!"

Thanks,
-TK17

28
In the Media / Colorado - ESPN - Parkour (in both Colorado and Lisses)
« on: November 06, 2007, 07:31:07 PM »
Watched it on ESPN a couple of hours ago ...

I just wanted to say that Colorado Parkour has put together one of the best representations that the discipline has seen on US television.  True, the reporters and narrators were a little fuzzy on the flip issue, but who isn't?  An absolutely outstanding segment, high-class traceurs (and I mean that in spirit as well as in skills), and a truly inspiring presentation of a trip to Lisses.  I wish it had gone on for another hour.

Kudos, guys.  Congratulations, and thank you.  Thanks so much.  Everyone who took part in it should be proud, if you weren't already.  Respect for all of the Colorado traceurs is going through the roof right now.

If anybody ever manages some legal way to share it over the internet, I'd love a copy, or even just a chance to see it again.

29
Colorado / ESPN Segment
« on: November 06, 2007, 05:26:21 PM »
I just wanted to say that Colorado Parkour has put together one of the best representations that the discipline has seen on US television.  True, the reporters and narrators were a little fuzzy on the flip issue, but who isn't?  An absolutely outstanding segment, high-class traceurs (and I mean that in spirit as well as in skills), and a truly inspiring presentation of a trip to Lisses.  I wish it had gone on for another hour.

Kudos, guys.  Congratulations, and thank you.  Thanks so much.  Everyone who took part in it should be proud, if you weren't already.  Respect for all of you is going through the roof right now.

30
North Carolina / Re: Man Carving Himself statue at UNCC ...
« on: October 30, 2007, 11:01:53 AM »
I <3 U

31
North Carolina / Re: Man Carving Himself statue at UNCC ...
« on: October 16, 2007, 06:25:53 PM »
No problem, you're busy, and it was sort of a selfish request in the first place.  There's no rush, that's why I didn't say anything 'til now.  Thanks again.  :D

32
North Carolina / Man Carving Himself statue at UNCC ...
« on: October 16, 2007, 06:50:47 AM »
... Stephen (Steven?  Stefen?) promised he'd get some good photos of it for me, but I think he forgot.   :P  If he, or anybody else, could hook me up sometime soon, that would be greatly appreciated.  I'd love a dozen different shots, but one good one is enough to please me.

33
Well, I'll try to make it to the second one, then.   ;D  Now it's up to you to make sure it's so awesome that there IS a second one.

34
ohfomehxr ...  :-[

You asked me if I had any input and if I'd be available, and I replied back IMMEDIATELY telling you yes on ANY day but this one, and then you never ever answered me back and you went ahead and scheduled it for that day. :'(

Why, oh why?

Well, best of luck to everyone anyway, hope it goes well.

 :-\

35
Pics & Vids / Requesting footage of traceurs who have been to Lisses
« on: September 11, 2007, 05:57:42 PM »
... for a collaborative, international video project.  I've got very good international representation through places like parkour.net, but I'd really like to include some stuff from the American scene.  Basically, the video is a story about the traceurs who go to Lisses, and what it means to us as a worldwide community.

I'll take anything anybody wants to offer me.  Finished videos, raw footage, random clips ... whatever.  It doesn't have to be parkour, it could be clips of traveling or hanging out or talking to people or just the scenery in the area.  I'd prefer medium or high quality footage, but I'll take whatever I can get.  Please e-mail vids or links to PKPilgrimage@gmail.com, or post them up here.  I'll also take people's thoughts about Lisses or parkour in general, if you have any you'd like to contribute ... you don't have to have been to Lisses ... if you've thought about it, or are planning on it, or just have anything good to say about it, I want to share your ideas.

This is not a joke, or a scam, or a random pipe dream that's never going to get off the ground.  The video's already being edited right now, and I pride myself on finishing projects once I start them.  I'd be honored to have footage from any member of this board ... my final product will only be as good as the people who participate in it.  Release date is tentatively set for Christmas, but it'll probably take me longer than that.

Please, very much, and thank you, also very much.  Best of luck, in life and training.
-TK17

36
In the Media / Small Local article
« on: September 10, 2007, 07:27:22 AM »
Burlington, NC, yesterday.

Unfortunately, in the print version, they seized on a photo of a wallflip that I was doing while warming up, before realizing that they'd already started taking pictures.  There are a couple of words out of line, references to flips, and they misquoted me a little.  But overall I thought it was decently done, and I was quite pleased that they gave so much room to the article, putting in bits about Lisses, conditioning, individual moves, etc.

For what it's worth.

http://www.thetimesnews.com/articles/germain_5597___article.html/parkour_time.html

37
NC Jams / Re: Regular Jams Thread
« on: September 04, 2007, 03:53:20 PM »
 :o :o :o :o :o

I didn't, either ...

38
NC Jams / Re: Regular Jams Thread
« on: September 04, 2007, 01:30:38 AM »
I'd prefer an address, too ... I know where you guys USED to train, but I recall hearing about some "new spots" ... :D

39
NC Jams / Re: Regular Jams Thread
« on: September 02, 2007, 04:05:12 PM »
There are some Thursday jams, right?  Thursday?  Pretty regular?   ???

I'm coming to Charlotte this weekend.  I've sorted it out to get there Thursday evening by about 6:30, if that's not too late to join in.  Otherwise, if I'm going to miss the Thursday thing, I could be talked into a Saturday evening or Sunday morning jam.  That is, if I'm welcome ...  ::)

;)

Pleasepleaseplease let me know soon, though ... the difference between Thursday night, Sat/Sun, or not at all kind of matters.

40
NC Jams / Re: Labor Day Greensboro Jam (NCPKJ3)
« on: August 20, 2007, 04:33:05 PM »
Starting at 10:00, if anyone's still interested.

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