Author Topic: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?  (Read 20216 times)

Offline Andrew Hull

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #20 on: September 24, 2010, 03:02:09 AM »
AAANNNDDD There it is. I stand corrected.
Rely on yourself. Rely on your body. Rely on your training, instincts, and heart. Everything else is a crutch.

Quote from: Dan Kelley
Don't wear shoes.  Make the pavement bleed.

Offline DaveS

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #21 on: September 24, 2010, 05:31:33 AM »
Andrew, read it again. I'm not arguing that flips aren't beneficial, I'm just saying that there are things that are more beneficial to help you with Parkour. Do you understand the difference?

And also Dave, I have a feeling that you've met many people fitting my description, following your trips to France, correct?
Over the years I've met people from all over the world who train to be practical and don't train with acrobatics, very few of whom have any kind of fame outside their local area. But yes, my first experience of it was with David Belle and the Lisses practitioners. David Belle was famous, but there were at least a dozen other unknown practitioners that I met who moved far better than anyone else I'd heard of at the time. They just weren't interested in being famous, because they understood that the purpose of Parkour is to help you get past real obstacles and achieve lasting benefit, not a temporary popularity boost.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2010, 01:45:47 PM by DaveS »
~ Dave
NorthernParkour and the British Parkour Coaching Association

Offline David Jones

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #22 on: September 24, 2010, 06:04:05 AM »
Didn't mean to single it out just to the Lisses Traceurs, (I know I don't live in France! lol) but I figured they were one of the primary examples of this.

Offline James Cavin

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #23 on: September 24, 2010, 06:13:33 AM »
Oh look! A new topic! Oh wait...

I don't know why everyone tries so hard to define parkour and free running. Words have limits. When you attempt to define parkour using a keyboard, you limit parkour.

Who gives a shit about what people use as labels? Parkour is for me. What makes you think I give a damn what you, or anyone else, call it?

Offline Cody Bolen

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #24 on: September 24, 2010, 07:59:10 AM »
Oh look! A new topic! Oh wait...

I don't know why everyone tries so hard to define parkour and free running. Words have limits. When you attempt to define parkour using a keyboard, you limit parkour.

Who gives a shit about what people use as labels? Parkour is for me. What makes you think I give a damn what you, or anyone else, call it?

We aren't discussing parkour and freerunning differences, in fact I don't think freerunning had been mentioned until you came along. Honestly I really hate this topic, but at the same time this is probally the most meaningful conversation I've had on these forums, that being said I'm going to wait to post a reply because I'm short on time.

Offline DaveS

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #25 on: September 24, 2010, 02:47:25 PM »
JCavin, words don't limit anything. Labels and definitions don't affect what they are attached to, all they do is describe.
What limits Parkour understanding in many people at the moment is the refusal to use words as an aid to understanding. Relying only on feelings and emotions and ignoring rational thought prevents us considering the past or future and gives us a very short-term view of the world.
To fully understand something you need to understand it both rationally and emotionally (consciously and subconsciously). For emotional understanding you need direct experience, but for rational understanding you need to think both before and after. Neither is complete without the other, because as humans we use both. That's why we've been so successful as a species.
~ Dave
NorthernParkour and the British Parkour Coaching Association

Offline Andrew Hull

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #26 on: September 24, 2010, 03:14:25 PM »
Thus the american education problem. I've SAT in classrooms where opinion and viewpoint has been taught as historical fact. In the "make your own world" that we live in, kids have been taught to equate personal position with absolute truth because they're the center of the universe. It's really disgusting.
Rely on yourself. Rely on your body. Rely on your training, instincts, and heart. Everything else is a crutch.

Quote from: Dan Kelley
Don't wear shoes.  Make the pavement bleed.

Offline hfksla

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #27 on: September 24, 2010, 03:15:27 PM »
I don't flip... because I can't :P
but seriously, look at my signature, there's a quote from Dan.
It's pointless arguing over ideology, go train.
Shut up and Train
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you anywhere
The moment you stop fighting is the moment you lose.~Dan Kelley
Repeat after me, I am free.

Offline Tex__

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #28 on: September 24, 2010, 03:38:31 PM »
Thus the american education problem. I've SAT in classrooms where opinion and viewpoint has been taught as historical fact. In the "make your own world" that we live in, kids have been taught to equate personal position with absolute truth because they're the center of the universe. It's really disgusting.
some things we disagree on, others we agree on. this is with out  doubt something i completely agree with.
To have no regrets would mean you never cared about anything; and if that's the case, you are a sad human being indeed. -FrostySTL

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Offline DaveS

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #29 on: September 24, 2010, 04:32:33 PM »
It's pointless arguing over ideology and trying to change someone else's mind, but there are few things more useful than discussing it and trying to learn.
~ Dave
NorthernParkour and the British Parkour Coaching Association

Offline David Jones

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« Reply #30 on: September 24, 2010, 04:42:49 PM »
Discussion is goodi. Stop bashing it.

Offline Andrew Hull

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #31 on: September 24, 2010, 04:47:26 PM »
David. Lay off the hash pipe. He IS discussing and saying it's good. Just... take the night off buddy.
Rely on yourself. Rely on your body. Rely on your training, instincts, and heart. Everything else is a crutch.

Quote from: Dan Kelley
Don't wear shoes.  Make the pavement bleed.

Offline hfksla

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #32 on: September 24, 2010, 04:50:36 PM »
No it's ok Andrew, it was my fault. I'll admit I only read the first few posts and just assumed it was gonna be just like the many other threads like this.
I agree 1000% with this ;D


I thought what you said was worthy of spreading. I haven't heard anyone convey that same message so short. +10000
Shut up and Train
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you anywhere
The moment you stop fighting is the moment you lose.~Dan Kelley
Repeat after me, I am free.

Offline David Jones

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« Reply #33 on: September 24, 2010, 05:03:32 PM »
It was in response to Andrew, not Dave. Wouldn't make any sense otherwise.

Offline Andrew Hull

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #34 on: September 24, 2010, 05:26:53 PM »
Oh...

*stares at hash pipe*

...

*puts down hash pipe*
Rely on yourself. Rely on your body. Rely on your training, instincts, and heart. Everything else is a crutch.

Quote from: Dan Kelley
Don't wear shoes.  Make the pavement bleed.

Offline Cody Bolen

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #35 on: September 24, 2010, 05:35:34 PM »
I don't know if this was done on purpose, but I've become lost in this topic. Was something that was crucially related to the last few posts deleted?

Offline Andrew Hull

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #36 on: September 24, 2010, 05:59:18 PM »
Cody, theres nothing anyone can say that can make sense of what I say.
Rely on yourself. Rely on your body. Rely on your training, instincts, and heart. Everything else is a crutch.

Quote from: Dan Kelley
Don't wear shoes.  Make the pavement bleed.

Offline max eisenberg

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #37 on: September 24, 2010, 06:26:48 PM »
Cody, if you don't understand how to use Parkour practically then it sounds like you don't really understand what Parkour is.

There is no other way to use Parkour, other than practically. Parkour isn't the ability to move effectively through your environment (although that is an effect), it's the ability to learn from effective movement, using movement as a tool. Caleb's right, it's been explained elsewhere many times, but there's no harm in explaining it again for the benefit of anyone who's not seen it before. The more it gets explained the easier it is to understand.

Parkour teaches you how to learn and develop yourself through movement. There aren't many abilities more fundamental than movement, since any interaction we have with the world around us requires us to move. More importantly, I would argue that there is nothing more fundamental than the ability to learn and progress. Without that we can develop no other skills.

Anyone can set and achieve goals, it's true. If we learn how to set 'realistic' goals then we make sure they are always something we can achieve and then it looks like we're being successful, and we never notice a problem.
Parkour approaches the issue of goals the opposite way. Instead of bringing our goals closer to us, and thus making them less worthwhile, Parkour gives us the ability to reach difficult goals by giving us the confidence in ourselves to keep trying until we get there. It allows us to look for and achieve the things we really want rather than having to settle for what everyone else tells us we should accept. It allows us to follow our own path.

In practical situations we don't use Parkour. Parkour is training, and in a practical situation we want effective action not effective practice. If a building is on fire a fireman doesn't start doing exercises, he starts putting the fire out.
When we are faced with a difficult situation we use the abilities that we have developed through Parkour.

Sometimes useful, practical movement is entertaining, but usually it's not. For something to be entertaining it needs to make a visual impact, it needs to look new and difficult to the audience. For something to help us learn and develop it has to make an impact on us, to be new and difficult for us.
Not everything that is difficult looks difficult. Not everything that is new to one person looks new to another. There is some overlap, but they aren't the same thing. If you're focused on practicing movement to learn from it then for much of the time you won't be entertaining. If you're focused on entertainment then much of the time it won't be useful for learning.

For learning about yourself, flips are no more useful than any other difficult activity that uses your human abilities. For helping you improve your ability to get past obstacles you encounter in life, flips are less useful than practical movement. For entertaining others, flips are more useful than practical movement.

If you want to practice Parkour, if you want to learn to overcome obstacles through movement, then practicing flips isn't as useful as practicing other things. They don't help you get past obstacles as well as other movements do.

Are flips useful...
...for Parkour? Rarely.
...for life? Sometimes.
...for people whose job it is to entertain? Yes.
...for me? No.
...for you? Work it out for yourself.

i agree, parkour doesnt have to be vaults and rolls. ive said this numerous times. parkour is about completing your goal quickly, effectively and above all else, safely. this can be getting from "here" to "there", or making your way through a building on fire.

we practice jumps for accuracy and awareness, we practice vaults for the same thing. parkour hones your climbing as well, instead of climbing slowly and smoothly, we learn how to do it swiftly with quick explosive movements. its not about the top ten vaults, the rolls, the precision jumps or any other movements we train. its the end result of learning all these movements in all scenarios. the ability to interact with your environment in the best way possible, that is parkour.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2010, 06:29:31 PM by max eisenberg »


my mind is constantly moving, one day my body will be strong enough to keep up.

Offline hfksla

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #38 on: September 24, 2010, 06:29:51 PM »
Cody, theres nothing anyone can say that can make sense of what I say.
and i dont know what im saying half the time
xD
Shut up and Train
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you anywhere
The moment you stop fighting is the moment you lose.~Dan Kelley
Repeat after me, I am free.

Offline Tex__

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Re: Parkour Purist, do they really exist?
« Reply #39 on: September 24, 2010, 07:14:56 PM »
dear god.... Hull is mumu in 5 years... we are screwed.
To have no regrets would mean you never cared about anything; and if that's the case, you are a sad human being indeed. -FrostySTL

Welcome to the f#cking internet.