Author Topic: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)  (Read 5891 times)

Offline Derek broussard

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AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« on: January 07, 2010, 08:50:03 PM »
      Breath hold DIVING

  best resource
How to freedive deeper blue

Breathing:
  Proper breathing is the foundation of a breath hold. Without it you will not have a breath hold.
  Breath up.
  For proper breathing
 Inhale 4 sec.
 pause for 2 sec
 exhale for 10 seconds,  Nice and slow, everything should be relaxed and not forced, if you cant exhale relaxed for 10 sec cut a second or two off.
 Pause for 2 seconds
 repeat.
 
 Last breath before the dive.
 
  start with a completely empty lung, 
  Inhale with your diaghram( only your stomach should move)
  once full, breathe with your intercostals. ( chest should rise)
  once full,  lift your chin up and get that little bit of air in your throat.

........................

 

Recovery :
 Recovery can often decide wether on not you black out at the surface.  Inhales should not be full breaths,  instead half breaths should be used. Remember you can BO up to 30 sec after a dive.
   •      5 ft from the surface start your exhaling.
   •     Immediately after surfacing take in your half breath. push down like you are constipated. this should force more blood in your head.
   •     take six more half breaths, should take no more then 7 sec.
   •     After recovery breaths give your partner the ok sign,
   
 

Mammalian reflex:
 "The mammalian diving reflex optimizes respiration which allows mammals to stay underwater for a long time. It is exhibited strongly in aquatic mammals (seals,[1] otters, dolphins, etc.), but exists in a weaker version in other mammals, including humans. Diving birds, such as penguins, have a similar diving reflex. Every animal's diving reflex is triggered specifically by cold water contacting the face[2] – water that is warmer than 21 °C (70 °F) does not cause the reflex, and neither does submersion of body parts other than the face. Also, the reflex is always exhibited more dramatically, and thus can grant longer survival, in young individuals."
upon initiation of the reflex, three changes happen to the body, in this order:
   1.   Bradycardia is the first response to submersion. Immediately upon facial contact with cold water, the human heart rate slows down ten to twenty-five percent.[2] Seals experience changes that are even more dramatic, going from about 125 beats per minute to as low as 10 on an extended dive.[1][3] Slowing the heart rate lessens the need for bloodstream oxygen, leaving more to be used by other organs.
   2.   Next, peripheral vasoconstriction sets in. When under high pressure induced by deep diving, capillaries in the extremities start closing off, stopping blood circulation to those areas. Note that vasoconstriction usually applies to arterioles, but in this case is completely an effect of the capillaries. Toes and fingers close off first, then hands and feet, and ultimately arms and legs stop allowing blood circulation, leaving more blood for use by the heart and brain. Human musculature accounts for only 12% of the body's total oxygen storage, and the body's muscles tend to suffer cramping during this phase. Aquatic mammals have as much as 25 to 30% of their oxygen storage in muscle, and thus they can keep working long after capillary blood supply is stopped.
   3.   Finally is the blood shift that occurs only during very deep dives. When this happens, organ and circulatory walls allow plasma/water to pass freely throughout the thoracic cavity, so its pressure stays constant and the organs aren't crushed. In this stage, the lungs' alveoli fill up with blood plasma, which is reabsorbed when the animal leaves the pressurized environment. This stage of the diving reflex has been observed in humans (such as world champion freediver Martin Štěpánek) during extremely deep (over 90 metres) freedives.
Thus, both a conscious and an unconscious person can survive longer without oxygen under water than in a comparable situation on dry land. Children tend to survive longer than adults when deprived of oxygen underwater. The exact mechanism for this effect has been debated and may be a result of brain cooling similar to the protective effects seen in patients treated with deep hypothermia.[4][5]
When the face is submerged, receptors that are sensitive to water within the nasal cavity and other areas of the face supplied by cranial nerve V (trigeminal) relay the information to the brain and then innervate cranial nerve X, which is part of the autonomic nervous system. This causes bradycardia and peripheral vasoconstriction. Blood is removed from the limbs and all organs but the heart and the brain, creating a heart-brain circuit and allowing the mammal to conserve oxygen.
In humans, the mammalian diving reflex is not induced when limbs are introduced to cold water. Mild bradycardia is caused by the subject holding their breath without submerging the face within water.[4] When breathing with face submerged this causes a diving reflex which increases proportionally to decreasing water temperature.[2] Activating the diving reflex with cold water can be used to treat supraventricular tachycardia.[6] However the greatest bradycardia effect is induced when the subject is holding breath with face submerged.

  Weights
  because a suit is buoyant and floats  you will see some divers wearing weights.
  If you choose to wear weights  you should not be weighted to sink,  the recommended, is that if you relax vertical in a pool your collarbone should stay exposed above the surface*.  This will be pretty close to the desired  33'.

 While your testing yourself  feel free to swim up. When you get your nipples to the water line is your "hard kick"

Types of freediving

warm up
 During warm ups do not  purge.
  To help kick off the Dive reflex float in the water face submerged. With a snorkel in your mouth breath up for 3-5 min.
  Do a couple easy statics or shallow dives. The longer you fight contractions the quicker your spleen will start pushing out red blood cells.
   
How to equalize.
  How to equalize.

Statics .
 Floating face down in the water. No swimming going for the longest breath hold you can,
 
free immersion (pull downs.)
   Find a rope that is taught and goes down to your projected depth. Pull yourself down with your arms. Do not use your leggs. keep your chin down, elbows in and pull down slow and relaxed.

 No fins.
 william trubridge is the master at nofins  his technique should be idolized
  "http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrXQbucZUDA"

 Fins.

  Finning is all about count and timing.

  Your first 30'  should be  hard kicks.    Normally your count is anywhere from 6-10 full kicks (LFT- RGT- 1-- RGT-2)
   FROM 30'-60' you should relax your kicks and water pressure will  help push you deeper. again it should take you another 6-10 kicks.
   From 60' -  You will hit the SINK PHASE  Just relax  and enjoy the ride..
     THe way up is just the opposite, -x - 30' strong even paced kicks. No need to go balls to the wall stay calm.
     30 and up relax your kicks focus on your surface protocall and let your suit do most of the work. 

 Hope this gets you guys started, There is a lot to this freediving stuff and I will be posting more information
« Last Edit: January 11, 2010, 12:07:10 PM by Derek Broussard »

Offline Gregg HIPK

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2010, 01:16:10 PM »
Thanks, Derek. Very cool information. I'm sure the results will show soon ;D

Everyone else [and me!] - remember Derek's advice to use a spotter when you're trying this stuff. A lifeguard is trained to see trouble at the surface, and probably won't see you until it's too late.

Offline Ozzi

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2010, 01:46:09 PM »
Very awesome info, confused about some terminology but I am just not used to it.

I guess I should be very proficient at this before shark diving huh derek?
"Be the change you want to see in the world"
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Offline Derek broussard

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2010, 04:31:54 PM »
This subject is very long and has many many different aspects to it.
 
  If you are left with any questions or confused in areas let me know so I can address those and help you out.


 Ozzi:
 
     yes you should be very proficient in free diving before you shark dive.  Its a must. Instead of the sharks seeing you as a "fish out of water" or an animal not in its element, they will instead see you as another predator in the water. That knowledge in itself is very rewarding.

Offline Gregg HIPK

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2010, 08:45:51 PM »
Tho if the sharks see you as weak/ injured, you will see many more of them, much closer than you might otherwise  :o

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2010, 02:32:54 AM »
Tho if the sharks see you as weak/ injured, you will see many more of them, much closer than you might otherwise  :o

lol true story gregg, me and my buddy tried this out at sharks cove today.  We didn't dive deep, all we did was try to hold our breaths underwater as long as we felt comfortable with (holding onto reef to keep us from floating up).  We screwed up on the CO2 purging a couple times and got dizzy from our failed attempts.  Took a couple of minutes to recover and tried holding breath without the purging since we weren't 100% sure how to do it.  The last time I timed myself for holding my breath was back in highschool when I played waterpolo (also back when I was in peak condition)...I topped out at 2mins and 16 secs.  Today I didn't have my watch on me, be my buddy guesstimated that I held for 2mins 30secs.  The breathing up really mellowed me out and let me focus.

I have a question though, for actually holding the breath should I swallow it (that's how my dad taught me how to hold my breath for when we go diving).  Should I try to circulate it in my lungs as if I was breathing, or is that just a waste of energy? 

Thanks for the post derek!!

Offline Derek broussard

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2010, 10:09:09 AM »
 Ryan and I talked about the purging last night.  The way I wrote it makes it seem like you should be doing longer then what is safe.

  you should only do 2-3 purge breaths,( inhale taking .5-1 second and exhaling for 4-6 seconds semi forcefully)  the last breath before the dive should be a normal 10 sec exhale to get your heart rate back up.

 If your not understanding the purge, exlude it from your dive technique untill you understand it better.
Purging IS NOT hyperventilating, doing so can cause spontaneous blackout while underwater.


Ryan:

  those where some crazy conditions to do freediving,  But i'm glad you had a spotter.

 to answer your question.
 "for actually holding the breath should I swallow it (that's how my dad taught me how to hold my breath for when we go diving).  Should I try to circulate it in my lungs as if I was breathing, or is that just a waste of energy?  "
 

   breathing:
  start with a completely empty lung, 
  Inhale with your diaghram( only your stomach should move)
  once full breath with your intercostals. ( chest should rise)
  once full lift your chin up and get that little bit of air in your throat.

  If you start "sipping" in air it is possible to pack air in your lungs.  But this is a advance technique and comes with some risk.

 To fully answer your question I am sucking in the air until my throat is full, then I gulp in a couple extra gulps.




Offline Ozzi

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2010, 11:19:48 PM »
Purging confuses me, need to get some actual direction on this.
"Be the change you want to see in the world"
 Ghandi

Offline Derek broussard

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2010, 07:50:47 AM »

  I removed purging from the instuctions.  After thinking about it I decided that it is more of a intermediate technique. It is also not neccessary for a  good dive. Two of my deeper{than me} diving buddy never purge on dives.

 

naturalninja

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2010, 11:45:38 AM »
deeper blue link doesnt work for me:(

also in a real situation we're not gonna have time for any of this, its just gonna be a deep breath and then into the water, so is this really situational?:/

Offline Derek broussard

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #10 on: January 11, 2010, 12:17:37 PM »
Link fixed.


N. ninja: 
             While circumstances will determine how you can react or prepare. I find it difficult to find a situation where it would be unacceptable to prepare for the water.  The water is a deadly environment unless the person is physically and mentally prepared and trained to handle such. 

    In training, Pleasure, food gathering, and a large majority of egressions the practitioner will have ample time to prepare with proper breathing techniques. 
 
   Only situation I can think of would be a survival situation such as a rouge wave or river pulling you into the water. In which case your previous training and knowledge of the fundamentals may be enough to put the dice on your side.

Offline Gregg HIPK

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #11 on: January 11, 2010, 12:44:38 PM »
Ya, about the only other situations I could think of would be an emergency rescue, or trying to escape by hitting the water. In those cases, you wouldn't have time to do a lot of prep, tho I'm sure the training would help. For the rescue, you could do some of the breathing/ face in water stuff as you were swimming out.

For the escape, I guess first breath would have to rely on adrenaline and practice. Second breath could be a proper one.

naturalninja

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #12 on: January 12, 2010, 09:14:38 AM »
yea i know i wasnt saying it wouldnt help, just that something else might help more?

you know like S.A.I.D and all

Offline Derek broussard

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2010, 12:24:02 PM »
yea i know i wasnt saying it wouldnt help, just that something else might help more?

you know like S.A.I.D and all

 ?? What !??

Offline Gregg HIPK

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Re: AQUATIC APE ( Intro to freedive)
« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2010, 02:25:44 PM »
SAID = Specific Adaptation to Imposed Demand.  When the body is placed under some form of stress, it starts to make adaptations that will allow the body to get better at withstanding that specific form of stress in the future.

The basic rule about getting better at anything is to keep progressing the level of difficulty of the training without getting hurt or overtired.

Remember to keep training simple – if you want to get better at X, do X as hard as possible without getting hurt or overtrained.  Be very skeptical of the carryover or transferability of “functional training” or even training that purports to be “sport specific.”  Chances are, its not.

THIS was the best explanation I found [of the 2 I looked at ;D ]

Ninja -- chances are if you're in the water, and you need to do a deep dive, or stay under a long time, you'll have some sort of prep time. If you're jumping off a cliff, you won't have the chance to trigger the face-in-water reflex thingy. If you expect you'll be doing a lot of cliff jumping to long underwater swims... then apply the SAID principle, and practice jumping off small cliffs, and doing shorter underwater swims.

SAID is very MN... If you want to run fast, run fast. If you want to climb better, practice climbing. If you need to deep dive, practice that. Thanks Derek for all the ideas, and Ninja for bringing up SAID.