Author Topic: Better as an unknown sport?  (Read 9478 times)

Offline Wenxin Yang

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Better as an unknown sport?
« on: August 08, 2009, 08:50:12 AM »
Now that Barclay World Freerun Championships are reaching it's 2nd year, I can't help but wonder, is this how parkour is going to turn out to be? A widely broadcasted, company sponsored "sport" that everyone knows? I started practicing Parkour because it was an unknown sport that was non-competitive. It had more appeal to me then, then it is now. I feel like Parkour has strayed from what the founders really intended. Does anyone else feel this way?

Offline Jacquis "Curfew"

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2009, 08:54:11 AM »
i almost miss the olden days when it was "did you say park wars?? OH, you said par cored."  :)

Offline Kenn Andersen

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2009, 09:02:02 AM »
Aren't the Barclay World Freerun Championships, Freerunning competitions? Not parkour?  Regardless. If parkour becomes mainstream then it is going to happen whether we embrace it or not. I feel that so many people can benefit from the philosophy and it would be selfish of us to want to keep parkour unknown. I just hope that when it does become mainstream that it does not get corrupted by thrill seekers. I would really hate to see parkour show up in the Xgames or something like that.

What I love about parkour is that it is pure. No competition. Anyone and everyone can do it.
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Offline Grayson

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2009, 09:31:47 AM »
Competition is going to happen, there's no stopping it. The thing us traceurs need to think about is are we going to just standby and let a shoe company market it as an extreme sport, or are we going to step in and guide competition down the right path.

Also, Parkour and Freerunning is still largely underground and alot of people don't now about it.
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Offline Wenxin Yang

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #4 on: August 08, 2009, 09:35:24 AM »
The good old days.

Offline Andrew Wilson

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #5 on: August 08, 2009, 09:47:52 AM »
Either when it happens, we step in and say "We want nothing to do with this, don't associate us with any of them." Or, we must guide it down the right path.
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Offline Spencer B

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #6 on: August 08, 2009, 10:12:18 AM »
Guiding competition should be damage control and a last resort.We have nothing real to gain from competition aside from publicity, most of it outright controlled by the companies advertising it. If we get difficult, they'll just hire hacks to do it all. Stuntman and gymnasts and play it off as PK. We have to stand, either against competition totally, or compromising our beliefs little by little with each new competition.
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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #7 on: August 08, 2009, 11:05:16 AM »
i almost miss the olden days when it was "did you say park wars?? OH, you said par cored."  :)

lol yea... even around here it is getting well known... which can be a good thing...  But for me it was, "Hardcore? wow that is extreme" and then me responding with, "no no NO! That is the exact opposite! Parkour with a 'P'!  It is very safe if done right"

But yea...  I agree that this is inevitable...  there is no stopping it, only guiding it...  We can still try to stop it, but that'd be overly difficult and people who don't care about the other people but still practice PK (You know, the retards that fall through roofs and break legs from 50 foot jumps without rolling) because they think that they are better than everyone...  But we can at least step in and steer it down the right road

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Offline EpicMovement

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #8 on: August 08, 2009, 12:20:32 PM »
Competition is going to happen, there's no stopping it. The thing us traceurs need to think about is are we going to just standby and let a shoe company market it as an extreme sport, or are we going to step in and guide competition down the right path.

Also, Parkour and Freerunning is still largely underground and alot of people don't now about it.

Barclay is a bank. lol

Offline Grayson

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #9 on: August 08, 2009, 12:26:41 PM »
Barclay is simply sponsoring it, Urban Freeflow is organizing it.
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Offline Cody Bolen

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #10 on: August 08, 2009, 05:10:34 PM »
If you don't want competition then don't compete, other people competing aren't hurting you so let them follow thier path and you follow yours. Why do want parkour to remain unknown? Are you selfish? I don't understand why it becoming common knowledge is a bad thing. As long as it's being shown in a positive light I see it as good. No matter what we do corporations are going to catch wind of the sport and will pick up willing atheletes. I know being non-competetive is part of the philosophy of parkour, but I for one would rather see someone concerned with keeping the philosophy(even if they break the one "rule") than someone who was just in it for the money.

Offline King Kraven

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #11 on: August 08, 2009, 05:11:32 PM »
Parkour should be a way of life not a competition.

Offline Spencer B

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #12 on: August 08, 2009, 05:23:21 PM »
If you don't want competition then don't compete, other people competing aren't hurting you so let them follow thier path and you follow yours. Why do want parkour to remain unknown? Are you selfish? I don't understand why it becoming common knowledge is a bad thing. As long as it's being shown in a positive light I see it as good. No matter what we do corporations are going to catch wind of the sport and will pick up willing atheletes. I know being non-competetive is part of the philosophy of parkour, but I for one would rather see someone concerned with keeping the philosophy(even if they break the one "rule") than someone who was just in it for the money.

It's not the publicity I'm against... But not all publicity is good publicity obviously.

Bringing competition into it makes it a sport. Not a discipline. Not an art form. Not an expression of creativity... A sport.
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Offline Matt Stick

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #13 on: August 08, 2009, 05:36:48 PM »
I dont see parkour as being mainstream in the way of x-games or whatever. all we'll really see are purists and stupid kids jumping off roofs. NOt much different from today...
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Offline Alex B

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #14 on: August 08, 2009, 05:53:52 PM »
my feeling is that freerunning will go mainstream as a competition sport, and parkour will be either less well known, or known as more of a martial arts kinda thing (non-competition martial arts)
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Offline Grayson

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #15 on: August 08, 2009, 06:14:04 PM »
If you don't want competition then don't compete, other people competing aren't hurting you so let them follow thier path and you follow yours. Why do want parkour to remain unknown? Are you selfish? I don't understand why it becoming common knowledge is a bad thing. As long as it's being shown in a positive light I see it as good. No matter what we do corporations are going to catch wind of the sport and will pick up willing atheletes. I know being non-competetive is part of the philosophy of parkour, but I for one would rather see someone concerned with keeping the philosophy(even if they break the one "rule") than someone who was just in it for the money.

It's not the publicity I'm against... But not all publicity is good publicity obviously.

Bringing competition into it makes it a sport. Not a discipline. Not an art form. Not an expression of creativity... A sport.

I have to disagree here, tricking and martial arts have become highly competitive, but they are still rigorous disciplines.
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Offline Cody Bolen

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #16 on: August 08, 2009, 06:22:22 PM »
If you don't want competition then don't compete, other people competing aren't hurting you so let them follow thier path and you follow yours. Why do want parkour to remain unknown? Are you selfish? I don't understand why it becoming common knowledge is a bad thing. As long as it's being shown in a positive light I see it as good. No matter what we do corporations are going to catch wind of the sport and will pick up willing atheletes. I know being non-competetive is part of the philosophy of parkour, but I for one would rather see someone concerned with keeping the philosophy(even if they break the one "rule") than someone who was just in it for the money.

It's not the publicity I'm against... But not all publicity is good publicity obviously.

Bringing competition into it makes it a sport. Not a discipline. Not an art form. Not an expression of creativity... A sport.

Please correct me if I'm wrong but don't certain forms of martial arts have competition? Aren't they disciplines? Are you saying that as soon as it becomes a competition it looses all forms of art also? Watch the clips from the last Barclaycard. All of them bring a different style, an artistic flare you could say. It's not like they're going to be repeating each others movements, so the creativity is going to be there also.

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #17 on: August 09, 2009, 08:20:11 AM »
I forget which contest it was... may have been Barclaycard or Red Bull's "Art of Motion", but one of the contests said that they let the Traceurs judge each other... that would really solve all of the issues because it would still just be friendly competition...

Plus, it is good for the crowd...

I still don't know what I think about competition... I don't really see how it can hurt IF we keep it friendly and don't make it about someone training solely to be better than someone else...  As long as we keep the philosophy, I don't see much bad about it

However... the Philosophy says that it isn't about competition, it is about navigating your environment...  so... Parkour is more or less just a mode of transportation...  Same with Free Running (They are the same thing anyways...) just you can say that Free Running has that flare of creativity...  But, the way I see it, PK and FR are the same thing... even David Belle does flips...

Well, I got myself off topic

Competition... I think that I am indifferent about it...  I can't see the future, so I can't say which way it will go... all I know is that WE can lead it to the right side

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Offline Cody Bolen

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #18 on: August 09, 2009, 08:33:29 AM »
I forget which contest it was... may have been Barclaycard or Red Bull's "Art of Motion", but one of the contests said that they let the Traceurs judge each other... that would really solve all of the issues because it would still just be friendly competition...

Plus, it is good for the crowd...

I still don't know what I think about competition... I don't really see how it can hurt IF we keep it friendly and don't make it about someone training solely to be better than someone else...  As long as we keep the philosophy, I don't see much bad about it

However... the Philosophy says that it isn't about competition, it is about navigating your environment...  so... Parkour is more or less just a mode of transportation...  Same with Free Running (They are the same thing anyways...) just you can say that Free Running has that flare of creativity...  But, the way I see it, PK and FR are the same thing... even David Belle does flips...

Well, I got myself off topic

Competition... I think that I am indifferent about it...  I can't see the future, so I can't say which way it will go... all I know is that WE can lead it to the right side

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Red Bulls Comp. lets the contestants decide who wins. Barclaycard has judges, but the judges are prevelant people from the PK/FR community.

Offline Dan Frank

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Re: Better as an unknown sport?
« Reply #19 on: August 09, 2009, 09:18:28 AM »
Please correct me if I'm wrong but don't certain forms of martial arts have competition? Aren't they disciplines? Are you saying that as soon as it becomes a competition it looses all forms of art also? Watch the clips from the last Barclaycard. All of them bring a different style, an artistic flare you could say. It's not like they're going to be repeating each others movements, so the creativity is going to be there also.

I've said it several times before, and I'll say it again: the Motion Arts bear crucial resemblance to Martial Arts. I think I'll make a list of similarities.

1: Disciplines, not just sports.

2: Focus on manipulation of the body, not, for example, a ball.

3: Maximum efficiency and effectiveness sought.

4: Method of training - repetition and slow, steady progression.

5: Lifestyles that vary from the norm.

6: Philosophies that go beyond the simple practice.

7: Varying, and sometimes conflicting, branches and concepts. (Ex: Parkour is to Freerunning as Kung Fu is to Wushu).

8: Focus on graceful/powerful/nimble/agile movements.

9: Requires quick reaction and creative thinking.

10: Clearly-defined techniques and strict form, as well as loosely-defined techniques and improvisation. (Ex. I have personally adapted the concepts of Jeet Kune Do in my parkour. Much as Bruce Lee would advise, I learn with strict form and then rid myself of it to become more effective. Others may prefer strict form all the time in their parkour).

11: Different styles of execution. Although this is not yet a manifest phenomenon, I predict that it will be in the near future. Different people naturally have different, idiosyncratic styles of movement. Some may be dynamic and angular, and others may be more fluid and smooth. Think Tae Kwon Do vs. Aikido.

12: Different technical execution. Much as the above, we haven't seen much of this yet, but there likely will be. Some disciplines or schools may favor vaults, while others favor jumps. Some may favor one-handed vaults over two-handed vaults, or cranes over pop-ups. Think Tae Kwon Do vs. Wing Chun - Tae Kwon Do predominantly features kicks and the legs while Wing Chun predominantly features punches and the arms.

13: Not originally intended for competition, but later adapted to it.

14: Trained to sharpen primal skills and abilities already ingrained into the human being.

15: References animals and nature for inspiration.

And there are plenty more similarities; this is just the beginning. If anything, you can expect the future of the Motion Arts to be much like the history of Martial Arts. (By the way, the title, "Motion Arts," I think, is an excellent solution to the 'what should we really call what we do' debate).
« Last Edit: August 09, 2009, 09:20:37 AM by Dan Frank »
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