Author Topic: Efficiency of vaults  (Read 2758 times)

Offline wgross05

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Efficiency of vaults
« on: May 29, 2006, 12:24:32 PM »
i was just getting into pk, and ive been watching a lot of videos and reading a lot about it on forums and so far, i think that a good way to describe parkour is to move in the most efficient way possible. if im wrong about the previous statement, then the rest of this post doesnt matter, but when i was watching a video the other day, a traceur vaulted over a 3 foot wall. personally, i think it would have been more along the lines of pk if he had jumped over the wall and kept on running. it seems that by jumping on top of the wall, you would be able to jump off, giving yourself further speed/distance, and if you just jumped over the wall, you could keep your speed, but when the guy used a vault, he seemed to slow down immensley. now i can see how kong vaulting over a car, or doing a vault over a higher wall/rail would be more efficient than trying to jump over it, but i think that it would be more in the spirit of parkour to jump up and over the smaller walls and rails, rather than bend down, put your hand on it, and then vault over.

i really hope i expressed my idea in a non-confusing way.
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Offline Jereme Sanders

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Re: Efficiency of vaults
« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2006, 01:05:30 PM »
Well its all in the technique I think....For example lets say I can sdc very well...so in that situation I would do an sdc....but then if someone isnt that good at doing an sdc but is awesome at speed vaults...then in that situation they should speed vault if they want to be efficient....What I am trying to say is don't blame the vault blame the person's technique.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2006, 01:07:07 PM by zujitsu »
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Offline Corndogg

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Re: Efficiency of vaults
« Reply #2 on: May 29, 2006, 03:18:28 PM »
i think if you just try it over time, empirically try vaulting vs. jumping over things (once your vault techniques are down) youll find that having a set of different vaults at your disposal and using them at the right time saves you energy, and is the most efficient.  that said, theres a time and place for each movement so sometimes yes, you will need to jump on top of something to get somewhere else.  but in general, when passing over an obstacle, vaulting is better...
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Offline Josh Maciel

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Re: Efficiency of vaults
« Reply #3 on: May 29, 2006, 03:53:11 PM »
I agree with Corndogg, it was exactly what I was going to say but I still don't understand the purpose of the Dash Vault other than to be able to do a Kash Vault.
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Re: Efficiency of vaults
« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2006, 05:20:04 PM »
I agree with the above. Vaulting is quite often more efficient than a regular jump. Dash vaults basically serve no purpose that I can find. Also, when you are training Parkour, you will often attempt movements with the mindset of "What if I was forced to do it a certain way in an emergency..." Such as when you underbar a railing that would be more efficient to vault. In that case, you are drilling a movement that might not be most efficient at that specific time or place, but you are doing so to develop a skill that may come to good use when you are forced to use it in the future.

Does that make sense?

Offline wgross05

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Re: Efficiency of vaults
« Reply #5 on: May 29, 2006, 07:18:21 PM »
yeah, thanks. actually that clears up a ton of my confusions. :)
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Offline Olloth Kenson

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Re: Efficiency of vaults
« Reply #6 on: May 29, 2006, 08:27:25 PM »
Another thing to note. The person who vaulted that three foot wall is likely working on his technique so that he may vault the height of a car. You can see how the height of a car is useful, but you can't see how a 3 foot wall is useful. Most videos are not true parkour, and often just show various clips of training, not any real path.

Most of the videos on here are "Look what I have learned" Or "See how I have improved" or "Check out my video editing skills". I'm not saying I frown upon this at all, it's perfectly fine and I do it myself. I'm just making the point that Yes, parkour is about being the most efficient, and No, just because a video is not efficient does not mean he is not training parkour, does not mean he's 'breaking the rules' and does not mean we will critisize him for something silly.

(Okay, maybe we will critize him, but usually all in good fun =D )

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Offline Skipper

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Re: Efficiency of vaults
« Reply #7 on: May 29, 2006, 08:55:49 PM »
Say you do a speed vault over this smaller wall. you stay low and close to the object in order to focus on the forward momentum. If you were to jump right over it, your whole body must clear the wall while you are vertical, meaning you need a much larger vertical jump. then when you land, you have to compress more for the higher jump and then regain your forward momentum.

But its all relative. Tony Jaa jumps a hell of a lot more than he vaults, but when he jumps, he gets into the smallest pike position and clears the object efficiently. so if you can jump faster and with less physical effort than a vault, then thats the path you should be taking, and visa versa. Like i said, its allllll relative to what you are capable of and what is faster for YOU :)

Offline Argon

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Re: Efficiency of vaults
« Reply #8 on: May 30, 2006, 09:25:43 AM »
Also, note that when you vault over something (usually) your center of gravity dosn't move up as much as when you jump over it. In this way, your body is forced to do less work (work= force * distance) to get you over the obstacle. This is why it "feels" so much easier and fluid to do a vault rather than just hurdling an obstacle.
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Offline Corndogg

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Re: Efficiency of vaults
« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2006, 09:59:04 PM »
I agree with Corndogg, it was exactly what I was going to say but I still don't understand the purpose of the Dash Vault other than to be able to do a Kash Vault.

for me, a dash vault works great when you need to clear 2 close things in succession.  its a very natural movement to dash the first then monkey/kong the second as your legs are out, and your weight is a bit back, then you transfer your weight forward for the next vault.  this just feels a lot more fluid to me then 2 quick monkeys etc. 
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